Path: senator-bedfellow.mit.edu!faqserv From: errera@ese.ogi.edu (Claude Errera) Newsgroups: alt.games.marathon,comp.sys.mac.games.action,comp.sys.mac.games.announce,comp.answers,alt.answers,news.answers Subject: [alt.games.marathon] FAQ-monthly posting Supersedes: Followup-To: alt.games.marathon, comp.sys.mac.games.action Date: 3 Sep 1996 22:21:42 GMT Organization: none Lines: 1336 Approved: news-answers-request@MIT.EDU Expires: 17 Oct 1996 22:18:21 GMT Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: bloom-picayune.mit.edu Summary: This posting contains frequently asked questions for the newsgroup alt.games.marathon, including where to find more information. It should be read by anyone who wishes to post to the alt.games.marathon newsgroup, or any related mac games group. X-Last-Updated: 1996/09/03 Originator: faqserv@bloom-picayune.MIT.EDU Xref: senator-bedfellow.mit.edu alt.games.marathon:24482 comp.sys.mac.games.action:34227 comp.sys.mac.games.announce:299 comp.answers:20925 alt.answers:20252 news.answers:80972 Version: 1.7 Posting-Frequency: monthly Archive-name: games/marathon-faq Last-modified: 1996/09/03 URL: http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/utilities/a.g.m.faq.html V1.7 September 2, 1996 Welcome to the Alt.Games Marathon FAQ! If after reading this, you still have questions (or know of questions that belong here), feel free to send them along. (My email address is errera@ese.ogi.edu.) All links are valid as of September 2, 1996. I'll try to make sure that new ones make it in (you can help by mailing any I've missed to me), and broken/disappeared ones (like that word?) get removed. This file will *not* cover information that's already covered in a current marathon FAQ. As of today, that list includes the Marathon Spoiler Guide: http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/spoiler/ (Recently updated) and the Grenade Jumping FAQ, offline for the time being, but downloadable at http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/utilities/gren.jump.faq.11.hqx and the Devil in a Blue Dress FAQ: http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/devilfaq.html or in downloadable form at http://www.ese.ogi.edu//pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/devilfaq.hqx and the Net Play Tips FAQ (still in its infancy, but send questions, and he'll update it): http://www.ames.net/marathon/net/ (Did I miss any? I'm not including the Marathon FAQ 3.0 because it is no longer being maintained.) This file will be reposted monthly, and pointers will be posted weekly. It is also available in html format at http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/utilities/a.g.m.faq.html or text format at ftp://wmj.ese.ogi.edu//pub/mac/entertainment/marathon/a.g.m.faq.txt Any major (or even minor) errors should be pointed out to me, so that I can fix them. Now, finally, when someone asks a FAQ on a.g.m, you can finally say, "Go read the FAQ!" Won't that feel good? Claude Errera errera@ese.ogi.edu ----------------------------------------------------------------------- CHANGES/ADDITIONS IN THIS VERSION: - Updated PC version question - Updated cheat programs question - Updated ftp sites question - Updated available editors question - Added Pfhorte objects question - Updated sight patch question - Updated 68K crash question - Added Infinity demo shotgun ammo (level 1) question - Added Infinity demo kkv location question - Added Infinity demo kkv-in-netplay question - Lots of link additions/subtractions ----------------------------------------------------------------------- General What kind of game is Marathon? Is there a PC version? How do I get more serial #s? Could someone mail me/post the game? Is there a way to start on any level I want? Are there any secret codes for Marathon? How about cheat programs? How do you take screen shots in Marathon? How do I find out what frame rate my machine is running at? Are there any useful commands not mentioned in TFM? Does Bungie rock, or what? Gameplay How do I get past Colony Ship/G4 Sunbathing/whatever? How do I get aliens to turn on in M2 net play? What's with the two greyed-out net game options in M2? Can I play Marathon over the Internet? Can I play Marathon over a modem? Is there any way to run faster than normal? Modifying Marathon What's a good ftp site for Marathon stuff? What's available in terms of editors? How do I use this 3rd party Map/Physics Model/stupid thing? Are there any maps designed after real buildings? How can I use Shapes patches on PCI macs? I made a very simple map, but I can walk through the walls! What gives? I'd like to add terms to my M2 map, but Pfhorte only let's me add 1! Why? How can I make objects I've added with Pfhorte show up during gameplay? Is there a sight patch for M2? Troubleshooting How come lots of map crash on my 68K mac? Can I stop this? How come my net-games keep fragmenting and what can I do about it? How come certain key combinations don't work? How can I get 16-bit sound on M2? How come I can't make films off of saved games? Is there a way to make films of later levels? I can't get Music to work! What's going on? I couldn't get the real-time mic to work in M2. What's going on? Why can't I use the mic in M1? Everyone else can... How do I change views in net games/films? Infinity Demo Is that shotgun ammo at the end of level 1 accessible? How do I find the new weapon on level 2? How can I shoot my friends with that new weapon? Appendix 1: Marathon Web Sites Credits ----------------------------------------------------------------------- GENERAL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * What kind of game is Marathon? It's a first-person, 3D texture-mapped shoot-em-up in the same genre as Doom, among others. It's better than the rest, but it's in the same genre... (How was that for objective?) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Is there a PC version? Marathon for Windows95 will be released on September 6. (This is an official Bungie date.) In the meantime, you can learn about (and download) the demo from http://www.bungie.com/m295demo.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * How do I get more serial #s? Call Bungie at (800) 295-0600 and order them, for about $15 each. Or check out their store on the web: http://www.bungie.com/store.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Could someone mail me/post the game? Get a life, okay? 1) Bungie's a great company-buy the software if you like playing the game. 2) It's illegal. 3) M1 is 12 megs total, and M2 is 52 megs. These are a bit large for posting... ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Is there a way to start on any level I want? Just hold down the Command and Option keys as you click on Begin Game. Likewise, for Cooperative play, hold down Command and Option keys as you click on Gather Network Game. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Are there any secret codes for Marathon? You mean besides that command-option thing up above? Well, maybe. It's possible to empty an entire clip nearly at once by holding down the fire key and tapping next and previous weapon very quickly (emphasis on very). I'm not sure you'd call this a cheat code, but it's certainly undocumented in any Bungie literature. There were lots of cheat codes in the M1 beta (PATHWAYS, PZBXAY, TOASTER, FATMAN, PISTOL, FISHEYE, ISEEYOU, HAVESOME, OXYGEN, HEALTH, AMMO, ASLAG, and probably many more), but they were pulled out before release of the demo or the full commercial version, and they didn't seem to ever make it into M2 (although the really early stuff never got out...). ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * How about cheat programs? Sure. For adding weapons, ammo, health, powerups, oxygen, or objects (like uplink cards), the cheater to get is Eggert Thorlacius' Marathon Cheater 5.0.1. It currently works with Marathon, the Marathon Demo, Marathon 2, the Marathon 2 Sneak Preview, the Marathon 2 Demo, and the Infinity Demo. Its only shortcoming is that it requires a saved game in order to function. (That is, you can't use it to give yourself unlimited powers at the beginning.) Also for both M1 and M2, you can use the Marathon Universal Patcher, which actually modifies the Marathon app to start your player out with greater stats. It was created by Naoki Yokoyama. For M2 only, you can grab a copy of Tim Swihart's Maramacros. These are MacsBug macros, and as such require MacsBug, available at finer Apple ftp sites everywhere. Once installed (and they come with extremely detailed installation instructions), they allow you to give yourself anything you want, without the necessity of saving first. Extremely handy... For all flavors of M2, plus the Infinity Demo, there's the Infinity Game Wimp. It's a lot like the Marathon Cheater, except that it adds some flexibility and ease-of-use for folks who like to cheat a little bit. For M1, and for 68K only, there's the Plus Key Save Anywhere patch. This allows you to save anywhere using the Plus key. (Um, I guess the filename made that last sentence uneccessary...) Unfortunately, it doesn't work with PowerMacs, or with M2. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * How do you take screen shots in Marathon? Command-shift-3 doesn't seem to work. Three ways: The free way is to hit Shift-5 *before* hitting command-shift-3. (The % sign (shift-5) gives more processing time to the OS, which allows the regular screen shot combo to work.) The fancy free way is to download PIXs, an exclusive MacUser screen-snap utility available only from ZiffNet's MacUser web site or from ZiffNet forums on online services. MacUser's Home Page: http://www.zdnet.com/macuser/ PIXs Page: http://www.hotfiles.com/swbrowse/MC10/5/5/mac-MC10556.html The not-free way (but it has other advantages) is to download Snapz, a screen-snap utility from Ambrosia Software . With any of these routes, here's a hint for getting clear shots (since screen shots are rarely instantaneous): instead of taking the shot during gameplay, replay the film and slow it down to nothing before taking the shot. (Obviously, this assumes you can get a film of the area in question. Remember Maramacros, if you're doing this in M2.) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * I see all these posts comparing frame rates for Marathon. How do I find out what frame rate my machine is running at? Shift-/ (or ?, if that makes more sense to you). This works for both Marathon 1.2 and 2.0. It doesn't work for 1.0 or 1.1. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Are there any useful commands not mentioned in TFM? (like using the [] keys to speed up/slow down films, how to get frames per second, etc) Well, actually, the bracket keys thing *is* mentioned in the manual... and I don't know of any other ones. (Feel free to send 'em to me, if you do.) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * Does Bungie rock, or what? Indubitably. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- GAMEPLAY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * How do I get past Colony Ship/G4 Sunbathing? Read the Spoiler Guide: http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/spoiler/m1/13.html and http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/spoiler/m1/8.html (This is a general answer for all spoiler-type questions. Go to http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/spoiler/ for other levels, of course...) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * How do I get aliens to turn on in M2 net play? I've checked the aliens box in the Gather dialog, but they never show up! They don't show up because Bungie left them out of their net levels. Whether this is a good or bad decision is totally a matter of personal opinion, but people seem to have almost religious convictions about it one way or the other. (Personally, I like not having them. They just got in the way of shooting my friends.) Bottom line, though.... that's the way it is, deal with it. There are at least three workarounds. 1) Add your own aliens to Bungie's net levels, using a tool like DOPE or Pfhorte. 2) Download one of the over 500 third-party M2 levels. A very large percentage contain aliens, and the same tools can be used to add them to the levels that don't have any (or don't have enough). 3) Shoot your friends more. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- * What's with the two greyed-out net game options (Keep Away from Rob and Pile on Greg) in M2? Are they just cruel jokes perpetrated on the adoring Marathon public by those meanies at Bungie? Or did they just never get around to finishing them? Here's the old answer: Well the wisdom for a long time was, they were planned but scrapped because of time considerations. However, recently Jack Lin Open your Pfhorte app in Resedit, and edit MENU resource 1012. (This should be weapons.) Scroll to the bottom of the list, and insert two new items after Green Ball: Submachine Gun and Submachine Gun Clip. (What you call these two slots is irrelevant, but their position is not.) Close and save. For anyone who doesn't feel like screwing with Pfhorte, a version of Duality (the net map that comes with the demo) has been modified to include two KKVs and a bunch of ammo, and can be found at the Marathon HyperArchive and the Marathon Hotlist. (Addresses below.) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- APPENDIX 1: MARATHON WEB SITES ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Start with this one: it has links to almost every Marathon site around: http://www.mit.edu:8001/people/dcoufal/mac3d.html or http://methane.mit.edu:8001/user/coufal/mac3d.html or http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/dave/mac3d.html ---------------------- GENERAL (MULTIPURPOSE) ---------------------- http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/ almost every downloadable file available for Marathon, links http://www.herringn.com/personal/aaron/marathon/hotlist.html lots of files, links, local maps http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/ Marathon Central: many marathon pages http://www.ames.net/marathon/ files, links (and lots of Netscape 2.0 stuff...) http://imlab9.landarch.uiuc.edu/~ken/marathon/ files, links, discussion pages http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/story/ tons of info about Marathon's background -A MUST READ http://www.bungie.com/ Bungie's home page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/netlink/ info on netlink http://www.cityscape.co.uk/users/ac53/TerminalSix/Marathon.html general info, links http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/motm/ Map of the Month page http://www.wolfenet.com/~stompbox/mara.html files, links, local maps, Pfhor Anatomy page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/maramag/ Marathon Magazine http://annubis.jrc.it:5757/MapSearch.html Search the Marathon Map Makers Guild mailing list (down often) http://www.mediablitz.com:80/palace/ The Marathon Palace (graphical chat) http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/MMMG/ Marathon Map Makers Guild Homepage http://enterprise.cit.cornell.edu/Pages/Marathon Nick's Marathon Page (files, links) --------------- MARATHON 2 ONLY --------------- http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/slurpee/marathon2/ http://www.grayphics.com/~brymen/ http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/wilhelm/Mara2.html http://www.win.net/~utumno/marathon.html http://www.tiac.net/users/epidemic/marathon.htm --------------- MARATHON INFINITY ONLY --------------- http://www.bungie.com/infinity.html http://www.amug.org/~marathon/slurpee/marathon2/Files/Infinity/Infinity_Q_&_A.html http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/infinity http://www.psnw.com/~sax/infinity.html http://www.grayphics.com/~brymen/infinity.html http://www.westernappliance.com/ccn/marathon/mi/ --------------------------------------------------- MAP PAGES (DEVOTED TO LOCAL MAPS, AND/OR UTILITIES) --------------------------------------------------- http://www.ese.ogi.edu/testinggrounds/ A site devoted to improving mapmaking skills http://www.odsnet.com/pfhorte/index.html Pfhorte2 page http://www.odsnet.com/pfhactory/index.html ydnar's Pfhactory page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/physics/index.html MaraModelEdit's Home Page (Marathon 1 physics editor) http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~hanson/alchemist.html Alchemist's Home Page (Marathon 2 physics editor) http://www.ai.mit.edu/people/jknight/M2sndconv.html M2 Sound Converter Home Page http://www.ru.u-tokai.ac.jp/~nao/e.index.html Dr. nao's Marathon Utilities Workshop (lots and lots of good stuff) http://museum.cl.msu.edu/~hndrcksn/Shape_Shifter.html Shape Shifter Home Page (Marathon 1 shapes editor) http://www.cjnetworks.com/~cubsfan/marathon/main.html Marathon II Physics Archive http://www.lava.net/~kirill/marathon/index.html Bach's map/utilities page http://www.grayphics.com/~frigid/fm-maps.html FrigidMan's maps page http://www.teleport.com/~matasar/marathon.html Ben Matasar's maps page http://www.unm.edu/~grok/maranet.html Jim and David's Marathon Maps page http://www.globaldialog.com/~tv/Maps/maps.html Mad Hackerz maps page http://www.rit.edu/~peg1485/OtherGraphicsPages/othergraphics10.html Patrick Gray's Marathon page http://apollo.ahabs.wisc.edu/individuals/students/hahn/marathonstuff.html Harry Hahn's map/utilities page (old) http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~mneylon/maramaps/ Mike Neylon's map page (old) http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~acrosenk/gabe/filmstab.html a_fool's film table (old) http://members.aol.com/DMMC1/DMMC.html Durandal Map Maker's Club page http://rampages.onramp.net/~tkmower/Maps.html Kelly's map page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/coon/ Coon's map page (old) http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/map/jesa.html Go wif Jeza page http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/canyonlands/ Canyonlands page http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/bobco/ Bob World HQ page http://www.teleport.com/~matasar/devil.html or http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/matasar/ Devil in a Blue Dress page http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/fusion/ Fusion works http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/mwest/ Marathon West page http://www.unm.edu/~brew/seth.html Operation Tantalus page http://www.ese.ogi.edu/pub/entertainment/marathon/combo/specuthon.html Specuthon page http://www.acm.org/~mangefeste/durandal/map.html Tony Mangefeste's map page http://www.mailbag.com/users/dloebl/m2maps.html Daniel Loebl's Maps Page http://www.afn.org/~afn02635/marathon/ Jeremy Condit's Maps Page http://www.hypervision.be/marathon/marathon.html Pfhornicator http://members.aol.com/dakonsoft/index.html DAKONSoft's Film Utilities http://www.eskimo.com/~vampile/M2_html/ Thumper's M2 Netmap Page http://www.ctnet.com/marathon/ The Marathon Gang's Map Page http://www.ypn.com/games2/a660.html Netgames2 Marathon Directory http://www.teleport.com/~keiko/M2.html Zapranoth's Lair (films) http://www.usyd.edu.au/~jhead/Pages/Marathon_1%262.html James Head's Marathon Page http://fluffy.neb.net/marathon/marathon1.html The Animated Marathon 1 & 2 Shapes Page (Shockwave required) http://www.magnet.com/~danr/marathon2.html Dan's Marathon 2 Page http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/swein/marathon.htm Steve Weintraub's Marathon Maps http://www.algonet.se/~spiff/maramaps.html Spiff's Marathon Maps http://members.aol.com/cacanul/marathon.html Christopher Canul's Marathon Page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/pid/ender.html Ender's Marathon Maps http://www.widearea.co.uk./black-pyramid/ Black Pyramid Software (some of the best solo maps around) http://www.oberlin.edu/~mblecher/hf/hf.htm Home Fries Software http://www.zone.ca/~carnator/marathon/ DOH's Marathon 2 Page http://nic.smsu.edu:8080/~pvs649s/Marathon.html Big P's Marathon Page (maps, physics, links) http://spidey.usc.edu/~black/M2.html Alex Black's M2 page (physics, films) http://www.dartmouth.edu/people/dsantoro/marathon.html Dave Santoro's Maps Page http://www.mother.com/~malkin/shrine/4pillars/index.html The Four Pillars Home Page http://www.northcoast.com/~gldleder/marath.html Gold Leader's Marathon Page (maps) http://www.northpark.edu/~pmarks/index_html/marathon.html Run, boy, run... (icons, maps, links) http://www.clinet.fi/~ilkka/marathon2.html Weird Marathon Center (icons, physics, films, links) http://www.ecnet.net/users/cuahb/ It's about Marathon Physics Models http://www.itn.is/%7Eeggi/english.html Marathon Cheater Home Page http://www.alaska.net/~wkamkoff/infinity/infinity.html Infinity Game Wimp Page http://www.oneighty.com/mmaa/ Marathon Map and Art Association -------------------------- MORE RANDOM MARATHON PAGES -------------------------- http://studwww.rug.ac.be/~tklskns/Marathon.html or http://mindscape.cyberkafee.be/Marathon.html Thomas Kluyskens' Marathon Page http://www.wolfe.net/~optica/marathon.html Marathon Junkies' HomePage http://polaris.net/~thorn7/marathon.html Thorn's Marathon Page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/icons/ Marathon's Icons (a must-read) http://www.inxpress.net/~alikchi/lingling/lingling.html The Unofficial Ling-Ling Home Page (Bungie's home page explained) http://www.webmedia.com.au/pfhrenzy/ Pfhrenzy! A CD-ROM Marathon peripherals collection http://www.scescape.com/marc/marathon/ Mark's Marathon Mayhem Manifest Page http://www.grayphics.com/marathon/gmt/ Grayphics Marathon Tournament 96 http://pepe.online.ee/~kutt/Marathon.htm Kutt's Marathon page (mostly links) http://www.angelfire.com/pages0/BOB16/index.html The Born On Board Bastard http://altitude.firsttech.com/ Minnesota Marathon Players Group http://www.bitstream.net/power7/ Power of 7 Home Page (Makers of M2 and M-Infinity music) http://gecko.desires.com/2.1/Toys/M2/m2p1.html Tech-Toys Marathon 2 Review http://www.junction.co.uk/bits_folder/marathon.html The Junction - Bits - Marathon http://www.undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca/~njlomore/marathon.html Nick's Corner: Marathon/Marathon2 http://www.lava.net/~kirill/marathon/game_variations.html New Net Game Variations http://www.dragonfire.net/~mucci/marathon/marathon.html Marathon 2 Terminal Guide http://ed.dwmp.com/marathoners/ Marathoners of Lower Michigan http://www.oz.net/~zone/ Marathon Network Players page (player group in Seattle, WA) http://www.mother.com/~malkin/marathon The Marathon Ring Official Site Did I forget you? Mail you URLs to me! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- CREDITS ----------------------------------------------------------------------- The following people have contributed to this document, either by submitting questions or answers. If you feel I've left you out, email me. ruin@netcom.com (Jeff R.) aaron_sommer@herringn.com (aaron sommer) corbeau@earth.execpc.com (Dennis Taylor) zed@screenhouse.com (Zed) mnbanek@rapidramp.com (Matt Banek) climax@grfn.org (Ben Chess) gabe@tj.edu.inter.net (gabe rosenkoetter) candys@wimsey.com (Candace Sherriff) kchang@u.washington.edu (Kay Chang) ben_wilkes@sciarc.edu gmcclell@pen.k12.va.us (george mcclelland) Jack_Lin@brown.edu (Jack T. Lin) Dan Martens (martensd@spots.ab.ca) rf reddig (ydnar@aol.com) Matt Soell (matt@bungie.com) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Last edited 3 September 1996 CAE