Delayed Steaming

Nan's Nook : Archives : Substrate : Substrate Questions : Post Substrate Prep Questions :  Delayed Steaming
  Subtopic Posts Updated Creator
Steaming  -    

By Kevin Smith (Canshroom) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 12:13 am:

I'm just wondering how long you could wait in theory before steaming your jars. Some days are limited as to how many jars I have time to do and it would make things go a lot quicker if I could prepare them the night before and then steam them the day after. I know that steaming will sterilize the jars...just wondering how long you can realistically delay the steaming after loading the jars with substrate.

By quote: (Quote) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 01:31 am:

the sooner the better, imo.
once you mix the rice & the water,
bacteria begin multiplying.
the longer you wait,
the more bacteria you have to eliminate.

By Kevin Smith (Canshroom) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 01:49 am:

Point taken, quote. The time frame would be around 16 hours between preparation and steaming. In your opinion, would the bacterial growth be too much to eliminate after this amount of time? Thanks in advance.

By ggg (Ggg) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 02:33 am:

I've heard that letting them spoil slightly before you cook em may, I say may, give the fungus more food. The dead nasties you kill in the boil might be, I say MIGHT be, fast food for fungus!
I have heard of people waiting several days but WHY RISK IT?
ASAP is good.
16 hours is not that long.

By Kevin Smith (Canshroom) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 02:44 am:

That's how I see it. I know that bacteria grows quickly, but I figure 16 hours isn't that bad. I'll avoid it if possible, but like I said there are days when I have time to steam, but not prepare AND steam, so doing it the night before on some occasions would help.

By Imok Urok2 (Imok) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 03:54 am:

All of the jars don't have to be done at the same
Do a few and then steam/pc.
If it takes a couple of days to make up the whole
batch you want to shoot, so what.
It is better for the jars to sit after being
steamed/pc'd than before :)

By Kevin Smith (Canshroom) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 04:02 am:

Imok...I'm not too concerned about inoculating them at the same time. Like I've said, on some days I have time to steam the jars, but don't have to prepare the substrate and fill them beforehand. That's why I wanted to know if it's possible to do that part the night before so when I have a busy day the next day, I can just go ahead and steam them.

By Imok Urok2 (Imok) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 05:17 am:

Maybe try and keep them cold?
Should retard growth of contams?
Maybe steam/pc longer? (pc better!)
Hope it works out for you :)

By quote: (Quote) on Sunday, January 06, 2002 - 02:23 pm:

you can get away with 16 hour delay,
if that's just the situation.

By Sleemo (Sleemo) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 03:36 am

I made my jars a few nights ago but wasn't able to sterilize them until tonight because my wife "misplaced" my pressure cooker. My question is... Will sitting a few days before I get them sterilized cause any moisture loss in the cakes? or is there a more likely chance of contaminates by leaving them unsterilzed for a few days? Thanks in advance :-)

By Quote (Quote) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 03:38 am

should have refridgerated them, but they should still be ok. sterilize a full hour.

By Sleemo (Sleemo) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 03:46 am

I have heard that sterilizing too long can cause the cakes to dry out from the heat...any truth to that?

By Fishy1 (Fishy1) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 03:50 am

Isnt the fridge the most bacteria riddled place in the house? How do you keep the jars clean?..

By Quote (Quote) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 03:50 am

just keep the jars up off the bottom of the pot,
and don't let the pot run dry.

By Professorx (Professorx) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 04:09

If the jars are sealed (as they should be immediately after filling with brf/verm), then bacteria in the surrounding environment isn't really a factor. Rather, the refrigerator is to make sure that any bacteria that is already in the jars grows at a slower rate so that there is less bacteria to worry about having to kill with the sterilization process.

By Quote (Quote) on Tuesday, May 01, 2001 - 04:13 am

thx for elaborating,
i tend to be rather cryptic at times.

Posted by: lil'MushMan Jun 27 03, 11:41 PM GMT
if one had to say... mix his substrate but then wait a day or two until sterilization would this be a problem?

technically, i know, this would allow more time for contams to dig their roots in but would it be that big of a deal? would it even be noticable?

Posted by: psilli me Jun 28 03, 12:42 AM GMT
24-48 hours should not be a problem. this will give time for endospores to germinate and actually make some contams easier to kill. I would not advise waiting more than 48 hours though. much more than that and the nastys could really screw up the whole deal. However, once sterilized I've found that jars full of sub can sit for a week or more before innoc'd, without contam.

Posted by: WebMycelium Jun 28 03, 12:42 AM GMT
Well molds need germination time as well(I think mold germination is quicker than spores though). Bacteria takes over kinda quick in the right enviroment.

You should be ok with a day or two but I dont understand why you cant just mix it up right before you sterlize? Its a very quick procedure.

Posted by: Nanook Jun 28 03, 01:34 AM GMT

I will add... At what temperature, and how long, would you let say... A bowl of oatmeal sit... And still consider it safe to eat?

Use exactly the same guideline for dampened substrate as you would for leftover food.

PPS: Contams germinating and multiplying on the substrate are using up the food energy you want your shrooms to get. They also "crap" where they eat (so do shrooms) and the chemical characteristics of the substrate will change from contam metabolic wastes... They produce toxins, they change the pH of the substrate.

You don't want to be growing in a screwed up jar environment, the tek performance will degrade.

Posted by: lil'MushMan Jun 28 03, 09:38 AM GMT
so it is possible to do it. and it isnt too big of a problem (being only 12-14 hours), then hopefully it will all work out.
<is there anythin else i should know on the subject?>

another question that pops in mind is a little of topic, but hell i started this thread so i dont think i am breakin anyones hearts <am i?>.

i am getting 2 spore syringes and i will be innoculating 14 jars. is this enough to go around? how much should be put in each hole?

it seems as though each hole would only be getting just over a drop. i always figured more would be put in to each...


Posted by: Fungusmaximus Jun 28 03, 03:23 PM GMT

Immeadiately after PCing I place a clean trash bag inside a box, and use it as a liner. Then I put the warm jars inside the bag spray quick shot of lysol and tie the bag up,tight.
Ive left them like this for 1 month plus+ and had no problems at all, once inoculated. wink.gif


Posted by: lil'MushMan Jun 28 03, 04:28 PM GMT
shit man

that is a lot of reading

thanks though buddy

i have to get goin on it tongue.gif

oh is this sterile enough? if i had tape on the lids before i steamed and then after just put the needle thru the tape. then after that put another peice of tape on real quick. between inoculizations i would sterilize it. should i flame it? or just use rubbing alcohal or something?


Posted by: WebMycelium Jun 29 03, 12:13 AM GMT
Flame it , second layer of tape is just fine. Remove tape at 60%-70% colonization and flip jar on its top to finish em out wink.gif


If you think thats alot of reading better think again youve only begun to scratch the surface ohmy.gif

Posted by: lil'MushMan Jun 29 03, 01:04 AM GMT
hahaha i know that is true

they all lead to other ones ohmy.gif

good info though

Posted by: Nanook Jun 29 03, 02:34 AM GMT
It's a trap wink.gif

Shroom Glossary