Think my first batch is toast

Nan's Nook : Archives : Jars : Incubation : Incubation Problems : Think my first batch is toast
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Slow or Stuck Jars  -    

By onediadem (Onediadem) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 09:26 am:

I started my 1 pt pf tek jars on nov. 18th. I flipped the jars 3 days ago, and now the mycellium headed toward what was once the bottom, now top is not rhizmorphic anymore, but a puffy white. There is also a transparent white around the edges of one of the jars by the the growing mycellium. other than that, they seem ok. a little tinge of tanish white is center of innoc sites. think I need to trash em and start over? I would rather be safe, than spend anymore time on these jars if you think they are toast. thanks all
live long,

By onediadem (Onediadem) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 09:44 am:

On a second though, should You guys feel i need to toss them, Which area on my property should i dump em, with a possibility of something happening at a later date? Under trees? on a hill covered with trees? on an open feild in full sun? on a hill with no trees? The hill behind my house is covered with trees, stays moist yearound, wild ferns thrive there, a deep bed of fallen leaves.
What do ya think? I could uncover some leaves and dump them there, then recover with leaves. I think my jars are ok, but if not,?????
thank you,
live long, pj

By ShrooMaster (Shroomaster) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 10:39 am:

i once had the same thing happen to me. i chalked it up to contams.

i dont think you have a chance of gettin anything off a cake you compost now. winter cold will surely kill it, that is if you live in a place that gets cold. or if your even in the middle of winter now. if its summer or it stays warm put thm somewhere out of direct sunlight.

By quote: (Quote) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 04:03 pm:

your cakes sound ok to me pam, no need to pitch them yet.

By Nan (Nanook) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 05:52 pm:

Yeah, it is not that unusual to have growth in a jar change in type and appearance as colonization progresses. Don't be so quick to give up and discard. I agree with "Quo", I bet your jars are fine

By An guy (Boomer) on Sunday, December 09, 2001 - 09:42 pm:

>>now top is not rhizmorphic anymore, but a puffy white.

That's what happened to mine when it got ready to start pinning. The cottony stuff also was big around the bases of the larger clusters. I, myself, think it's a specialization, an organ, if you will, for better air transfer when it's time for fruiting. Sort of like coral filters or gills. Or fuzzy white lungs.

By onediadem (Onediadem) on Monday, December 10, 2001 - 12:26 am:

Ah, good deal, I will let them run their run their course and see what we come up with. Thanks guys/gals?
Simply marvelous darlings.
live long, pam

By An guy (Boomer) on Monday, December 10, 2001 - 07:07 am:

yer so swayvee.

I loves me some swayvee.

Kin yew give me som morre lessons in swayvee?

By onediadem (Onediadem) on Monday, December 10, 2001 - 08:55 am:

Well guy,
I am really not so sure I have any swayvee stuff to offer, other than a big ole smile and wink, sorta like this babe
I also like the lung thing, kinda looks like it has velvet trim too, but evactly like you described. They seem a touch dry, by looks.
tra la la la la

By Sillycybin (Sillycybin) on Thursday, December 13, 2001 - 12:28 am:

I am going to go out on a limb here and
agree with Nan and Quote and everyone else. I think your white growth is just another form of mycelium growth.

What no one else seemed to address was your question about tannish discoloration at innoculation points.If you are getting a bit of tan in the center of the innoculation points, it could be one of two things:

1) Your jars are a tad too wet and this is the 'yellowing' that is sometimes apparent.
Solution--if your jars are far enough along, remove tape to allow a bit of evaporation. Or leave 'em alone, they'll sort themselves out eventually.

2)You are being too fussy and over-observant :) It's just regular old mycelium.
Solution--quit worrying already! You know you followed the tek to the letter. Everything will be fine.

By now, a few days after your original post, you will know whether or not your tanning has become yellowing or not. But i just thought I'd post anyways.

silly to post so post-usefulness, isn't it?

By Ron (Clubbenguy) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 08:23 am:

Ok, 1st attempt lost all jars to contams. Second attempt, only lost 1/2 my jars to contams. I believe my second attempt will yield only two mushrooms...casing looks like its starting to get a greenish tint, but two mushies came already. Here we go for a third try... 1st question....Can u stack jars in your pressure cooker/boiling pot??? Currently i am using a boiling pot for sterilization, -I found a pressure cooker for 20 bucks but it only has one setting, 10 psi. Everyone is saying 15 psi is the proper setting but will 10 psi do the trick better than just plain boiling??? I am doing some 1/4 pint jars for kicks...I will keep you guys updated. Other than that....wish me well.

By quote: (Quote) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 03:21 pm:

that will suffice.
good luck!

By Doc Thirst (Doc_Thirst) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 03:56 pm:

It really bums me out to hear tales like this, I have been forunate enough to not have a single contam problem in several harvest, but then again I have yet to very from jars. Anyway, it's cool to hear you sticking with it. IT IS WORTH IT! Don't let a few less than successful attempts get you down.

By Dr. Cubensis (Shroomzilla) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 05:12 pm:

Hey ron,

The 15psi is mostly important for grains.

And, 1/4 pint jars will sterilize VERY quickly...
I would imagine 30 min ( brf ) would be fine...

And as for your yeilds... Geez man, try following
the MMGG if ya know what that is, then dunk, with the pf double case, you should get a LOT More than
just a couple mushies... :( Easy tek, VERY good success rate...

Hang in there....

By Serialkiller (Serialkiller) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 06:03 pm:

where can you find this mmgg. i cant find it in the archives. maybe i just wasnt looking hard enough.

By Dr. Cubensis (Shroomzilla) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 06:09 pm:

Magic Mushroom Growers Guide...

It exists on all 4 of the main mushie sites I believe..

Anyone have it handy???

It's pretty foolproof....

By quote: (Quote) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 06:19 pm:

it's just a re-written version of the pf tek,
quite a bit out-of-date since last revised.
stick to the updated original,
at pf's website, PF TEK,
and you can't go wrong.

By Ron (Clubbenguy) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 09:07 pm:

ok, #1 - no one answered my question about stacking jars inside the boiling pot/pressure cooker. IS this ok??

#2 - The PF Tek states that incubation temps should not go over 70 degrees, but everyone here says it should be closer to 80-85 degrees. Which one is right>??



By Dr. Cubensis (Shroomzilla) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 11:57 pm:


Sorry dude,

Busy day....

#1 Yes, stack as high as you can go, but make sure there is either a wire rack or rag on bottom of cooker. Also, make sure that jars are NOT touching lid, sides, or bottom. They can dry out this way and ruin your work. Good luck

#2 Yea, thats what it says, but around here the old timers say incubate at those temps ( 80-85 ). Colonizes quicker, which supposedly leads to other things such as better fruiting, higher potency, but don't quote me on that, those are just things I've heard myself...

By Jesseb (Jesseb) on Friday, January 18, 2002 - 11:57 pm:

Stacking the jars is fine. PF does not say that they SHOULD NOT be incubated over 70 degress. He says that AT 70 degress you will see growth. The 80-85 is what is prime incubation temps.


By Ron (Clubbenguy) on Saturday, January 19, 2002 - 01:24 am:

Thanks jesseb and doc for the info.

By Kman (Kman) on Saturday, January 19, 2002 - 01:44 am:

ya I went from 70 to 85 and they grew about twice as fast, highly recommend it!

By Oaktree (Oaktree) on Saturday, January 19, 2002 - 02:21 am:

hello ron, the pf tek i belive is for 12psi for 20 min. i think you might want to look at this closer. first, let me say,i am a newbie, but from cooking fish and other meats in a pc, time is critical. fish is at 10 psi for 1 hr 45 min. if the pc hits 12 psi for 20 min. or so, all the liquid is cooked of the pint jars. now with these small 1/2 pt's, a few minutes to long or to high might affect the final moisture content. i do not know if this applies here. in read'g alot(like swilly says: read, read, read!!!), not a lot of close attention is paid to this. might be an answer for some un-answered questions. like quopy says follow the pf tek. anyway, it is just a newbie thought.

By Dr. Cubensis (Shroomzilla) on Saturday, January 19, 2002 - 02:42 am:

"not a lot of close attention is paid to this."

Actually close attention IS paid to this by fairly experienced growers. Keep your jars off the sides, and bottom of the cooker, and thats all the attention needed.

" a few minutes to long or to high "

Nope, no big deal. As long as there is water in the cooker, and foil over the jars, they will retain thier original water content for quite awhile.

Plus, we are not cooking. We are not even CANNING, we are simply sterilizing with pressurized heat. Autoclaving if you will :). Purty tired right now, so how to explain this best?? Ahh,
See the pressure cooker section in the archives.

As for unanswered questions???
LOL! What are they? You are in the correct venue for the answers.....