Subtopic	Posts	Updated	Creator
	Sterilization	-
	Inoculation	-
	Delayed Steaming	9	02/24 08:43am	Kevin Smith
	Uninoculated jar viability	2	02/28 08:16am	J. Tay

Well about two weeks ago i prepared all of my substrate jars using the boiling method. I wasnt sure if i was sterile enough, left them on for about 1 hour, then took off heat, then let sit till cool. I wanted to wait to see if any mold develops on the jars. So its been two weeks and I have seem absolutley no mold, so i went ahead and innoculated today. Does this pretty much guarentee that I will at least not have had Precontaminated jars??? I dont think there's anything more frustrating than that.

By Brettiejams (Brettiejams) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 07:10 am:

Sure, your jars are prolly clean, but you could still get contamination during innoculation.

In fact, that is the most likely time you will get contams pre-birth; during innoculation, that is.

By Ron (Clubbenguy) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 07:15 am:

Yeah thats what I thought. I was pretty sterile during innoculation. Scorched the needle before every injection. Sprayed the whole room with a 90% water 10% bleach combo to kill airbornes. So we'll see. I am doing 12 full pint jars with 5 different strands. I got 2 jars of hawaiians, 2 jars of treasure coast, 2 jars of acadian coast, 2 jars of thailand, 4 jars of B+. I got enought left to colonoize about 54 full pint jars. Hopefully i will be in surplus in a month or so.

By Patrick (Valence) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 07:19 am:

I had a control jar that i didn't inoculate and had it sitting completly closed as tight as I could with the holes still taped on a shelf for almost 2 months when I noticed a little spot of green on it. From that point, it only took two weeks to be completly covered with green. Don't know how those little buggers got in but the other jars that I steamed with it and inoculated went on to give me good fruits. I have also had jars that where about 50% covered when the green showed after maybe two weeks after innoculation.
They come up at the damndest time.

By Brettiejams (Brettiejams) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 07:20 am:

I do them right on the (clean) counter top, use lots of rubbing alcohol on everything, and wipe the needle before and after every injection.

It smells like a still in the house afterwards, but it works well.

You'll prolly be fine.

Good luck.

Brettie

By Brettiejams (Brettiejams) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 07:26 am:

Hey Patrick,

If you keep the jars at a vegetative growth temp....85 degrees or so, you're gonna see the contam a lot sooner than a jar that is sitting on your shelf if room temp is cooler than that.

Maybee that had something to do with it.

By Patrick (Valence) on Friday, November 30, 2001 - 11:19 pm:

The shelf was in my garage and it averaged around 83 (early sept.) I just think the little buggers brought tools and really wanted in. Or they could have been in the middle of the jar and worked its way out. I'll never know. But it did suprise me when I saw it.

By urok2 (Imok) on Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 03:39 pm:

Like Quo once said to me:
Your jar is going to contam at some point.
Sterilization of the jar, when you cook it, is not 100%.
All the boiling/steam does is cut way down on the active contams.
Gives your stuff a head start in "contaming" your jar
(the stuff you shoot in is really just a controlled contam of the jar)

By quote: (Quote) on Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 04:19 pm:

very true.
i just recently saw this illustrated on some quarts of rye.
they were fully colonized, snow white.
but i didn't want to use them yet,
so i popped them in the fridge
and forgot about it.
4 months later, i re-discover the jars,
and almost half had contams growing in them.
the jars were never opened, so the contams were there all along, they were just so few that it took along time for them to become visible under refridgeration.

Foil Covers : Shroom Foil Covers

By Rick (Npno) on Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 08:38 pm:

I was wondering if the smell of the subtract is the same from when you prepare it to a week later when your ready to inocculate.

i'm just wondering so i can compare the smells to see whether or not its contamined.

By jim brown (Shrhobbyist) on Saturday, December 01, 2001 - 11:50 pm:

I think you mean the substrate. And if it smells different, it is a bad sign. You didn't take the lids off the uncolonized substrate to smell it, did you? That is not good, it creates a very high risk for contamination to sneak in. Waiting a week to innoculate is not necessary if you are doing the PF tek. Just mix, sterilize, wait a half a day or so for the jars to cool and shoot them up. Follow the directions and you will be fine.

By Organism (Organism) on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 05:04 pm:

I bought a bag of organic powdered brown rice and made some PF jars with a new pressure cooker I just got. I think it will work, I just didn't want to buy a coffe grinder and grind up rice. It doesn't specify that it was "long grain" though, just brown rice powder.
Also, How long should I leave the jars in the pressure cooker? I did mine for 20 min. @ 15 P.s.i. Is this right? I think..
Finally, should I be putting bent pieces of aluminum foil over my loose jar lids during press cooking to make sure too much water doesn't condensate into the substrate. What happens when too much water gets into the medium? Thanks whoever!

By quote: (Quote) on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 05:14 pm:

the rice will work ok.
20 minutes is a little on the short side, 30-40 is safer, but you prolly will get by with it.
too much water ruins everything, so the foil covers was a good idea.

By Organism (Organism) on Saturday, December 15, 2001 - 06:28 pm:

Cool, thanks quote. Oh yea,When I put my dry layer of vermiculite on top of the wet then cooked it- it seems as though the substrate shrank or something because there was a significant space from the rim where I had filled it with dry layer, is this normal?

By quote: (Quote) on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 01:40 pm:

it's not really a good thing, i usually overfill my verm. just a little to compensate for shrinkage.
just be careful handling it, don't flip it, or let the verm. move much, and you'll prolly be ok.

By Nan (Nanook) on Tuesday, December 18, 2001 - 08:17 am:

I am going to post here because re-reading it brings up an interesting point. I too get settling\shrinkage in the jars during the sterilization. To adjust I do exactly what Quote does... Overfill with Verm.

PF says to level the verm off. I pour verm in from the bag until it is mounded on top of the jar, then I place a lid on the mound, press down, and screw the band down snug. There is some compression.

Without this compression I find the dry verm layer is loose or "sloppy". It's not a problem if you incubate with foil covers and don't disturb the jars... But so many newbies are constantly handling the jars (without covers to boot), that a well packed dry verm layer seems important to point out.

I load my substrate "sloppy", but I mound the dry verm and make sure the contam seal is snug.