Nan's Nook: Archives: Misc Teks & Questions: OGBDlichenTek: Growing Outside ?: Experiment
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By monkeyod (Monkeyod) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:10 am:

Here's my 'lazyboy' experiment.

Being tired of fanning every day (and sometimes being out of town...) I wanted some way of not fanning and NOT contaminating my cakes. I like to grow very low tech and very cheap, so I didn't want to buy a vaporizer or fish tank air pump etc.

So after watching a HUGE couple of yard mushrooms patches growing in my front yard it stuck me that one might be able to recreate a more natural habitat for your shrooms. So...

I started by using OT's wafer tek. I took one of my bowls and added a base of verm.(damp) then sliced three 1/2 pint (that had already flushed once...got about 2-3 dry gs off each). I then added the sliced cakes then covered with 1/2 inch or so of damp verm. Then I sprinkled on a good handfull of rye grass seeds on top of the last layer of verm. and misted them. I put the top on the bowl and waited.

Well, wouldn't you know it the grass grew and so did the shrooms. I've gotten 185 wet gs with still more shrooms to pick as soon as they're ready. I'll get at least 200 wet gs from three cakes...not bad. I'm also picking them for tripping, not printing so they're all picked soon after the vail breaks so the weights are not inflated by growing them to retirement age. :)

By the way I have done NO fanning/air exchange...besides just opening up the lid to check them out every day or so. The verm was straight from the bag and no lime was added (only due to forgetting)

I picked the bowls (the blue bottom and the white 'top') up at a dollar store for a buck apiece so I think this qualifies as cheap. No fanning and big fat shrooms and no contaimantion.

AGAIN, THIS IS JUST AN EXPERIMENT: so take it for what it's worth.

I've started a few other like this in trays instead of bowls one (done with peat moss instead of verm is doing almost nothing in the shroom department) and the other done with verm has done OK (two cakes with 50 wet gs in so far with more shrooms growing)

Well that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Here's a pic before the first couple of shrooms are picked (that's a quarter ontop of one of the shrooms)
same as the first pic, but a different angle
few days later...
bowl with 'top' on

By An guy (Boomer) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:16 am:


I'm so excited- I was thinking about putting chlorophyllic plants in with them for air exchange- I am really into biomimicry, it's a big deal with me. Someone said it would introduce contams- I didn't say anything, but I still intended to try it.

You've taken what I was thinking a whole world further- MAN! Way to go!!

Cutting and pasting here boss....

Thanks Mr. Death!!

By monkeyod (Monkeyod) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:21 am:

At first I thought I might have cob web...but it was just the seed growing. They put out very fuzzy white roots. If you give this a try let us know how it worked for you.

By An guy (Boomer) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:31 am:

Will do.

I'm so frustrated- waiting for a cap to spread...

But it hurts so good....

By Eatyualive (Eatyualive) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:55 am:

it almost looks like how the mushies look when you pick em in a cow field.

By jim brown (Shrhobbyist) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:58 am:

That is great M.O.D. So the grass grew out of the vermiculite? How long did that take? What light is needed to get the grass to grow? It doesn't look like light can get through that bowl. Maybe it's just the picture. Regarless, it looks like it works pretty damn well. It would make a glass terrarium/aquarium look pretty cool, decoration-wise. Nice work!

By monkeyod (Monkeyod) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:33 am:

I'd say that the grass grew INTO the verm as I just tossed the seeds on top of it. It took about a week or so for the grass to sprout and get an 1/2 inch high and the pins were right there with the grass. Seems like the grass and the mycelium and the verm have become one mass. I can almost pick the whole thing up by the grass blades. Almost, but due to cracking of the 'cake' it's in a few sections.

There is plenty of light for the grass...the white lid gives a nice defused light. I've got my other experiments growing in dark blue(lids too) rubbermaid containers and it seems that enough light is getting through for the grass to be happy.

The grass, besides taking up co2 and giving o2, seems to keep the humidity up very high for the shrooms.

I don't know if I'll be getting more flushes with these as it seems to just keep the pins popping up and I just keep picking the big ones. I've also had a very low percentage of aborts as well.

Thanks for the nice feed back guys and keep on shroomn'


By jim brown (Shrhobbyist) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:46 am:

You say the light gets to the grass but what kind/wattage of light are you using? would my 60 watt regular bulb be enough for the grass? Also, what race is that?

By monkeyod (Monkeyod) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 09:01 am:

Mostly indirect light from the window is enough, but sometimes I leave my lamp (halogen) on during the day, but I don't think that is needed. If you stuck them in a well lit room they should do fine. I really don't care all that much about how well the grass grows/looks after all.

Ahhhh...race. I knew someone would ask. Not sure. I got a little sloppy with my tracking a while back and made some mycelium syringes without writing down what they were. Doh. I'd say SA maybe? Not sure if anyone can ID them from my crapy pics. Not really giving a hoot about the different races of cubes...they all seem close enough from what I've seen, but with that said I do like the Hawaiians.

It'll be awhile before I get my races straight again...I've got several of those syrings left and 1/4 pound of dry goodies in the freezer. I've got to start handing out early xmas presents to my friends.

By An guy (Boomer) on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 12:29 pm:

'I love you man'.......


By jim brown (Shrhobbyist) on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 07:42 pm:

Has anyone else tried this yet? I guess if so, it would probably be too soon to say anything about it. I am considering trying it on my next batch.

Monkeyod, are you still out there? If so, how is this experiment going?

By Timothy Leary (Timothyleary) on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 10:17 pm:

what about growing herbs off the cakes instead of rye grass, then you would have your own spices and shrooms.

By ion ewe (Ion) on Tuesday, December 04, 2001 - 07:09 am:

Many herbs have tap roots (the long, downward ones), including the one I believe you're speaking of... however, you can always place the round cake on the surface of some sterile, untreated potting soil in a pot. You must remember that sterile dirt is crappy for most plants, though, as all the nitrogen-fixing bacteria are killed along with any other benificent organisms. You can grow these plants through a sterile hydroponic medium (clay bits, gels, styrofoam, etc.) with a mycelial network living on top of it all...

Excellent work, Monkeyod! My buddy has done something akin to this with Phalaris sp. grass, just to see if the indoles enzymatically formed by the mycelia could somehow leach into the upper layers of material to the root systems of the grass, thus boosting said grass's production of desireable alkaloids by supplementation! It actually seemed to work, too!
I never mentioned these experiments here, as they are geared toward a slightly different chemical... but your idea is a very sound one, I can assure you!
You may actually be lucky to have decided upon rye as your seed. (Perhaps this was a directed thought, but you haven't specified as such ) The root systems of some grasses (like zoysia [sp?]) can strangle and smother the mycelia, but rye is comparably loose. The lack of good lighting can have a positive effect for these purposes, too, for if the green parts of the plant do not grow excessively, the roots do not have to grow proportionately to support them. I would suggest pet grass. It is edible, loose, and very soft. You can find little stands of it in pots at good pet stores. Just wash it with a room temp solution of barely soapy water and set the roots out over the casing. BTW, I don't think most grasses like straight peat. Too acidic by nature (limed or not). Use coir if you want to go that route, as it seems to balance itself.
Again, Monk, an excellent post and addition to the mind's archives!
Thank you!


"[Find me the laziest man to do the hardest job, for he will find the easiest way to do it.]"

-Henry Ford, founder of Ford Motor Company

Paraphrased, 'cause I can't remember everything...

By plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420) on Wednesday, December 05, 2001 - 12:32 am:

is that sleepy grass that you were referring to ion... i'm not sure of its proper name... if so, where can i get some?

By ion ewe (Ion) on Wednesday, December 05, 2001 - 06:20 am:

Are you talking about the "pet grass" or the Phalaris?
I'll assume you were speaking of the Phalaris, since I already explained where to get pet grass.
My buddy liked the idea of a "cleaner" extract of the species Phalaris Brachystachis, although P. AQ1 (Samorini) is stronger and other varieties and species of Phalaris will yield goodies. Don't think it has a common name, but also never heard of Phalaris referred to as "sleepy grass".
Seed and live plants can be acquired through OTJ (that might date me, I don't know) now called Allies... Look around on the web for references to this splendid little company. Erowid or The Lycaeum may have the current address in their FAQ's and articles on ethnobotanicals (drug plants used in ritual). You'll find it, I have faith...


P.S. The best thing about this particular concept is that the mycelia will supplement the plant, but that's only a part of it. You see, this particular plant creates more alkaloids when growth conditions are bad (low light, low nutrients). Dry conditions are preferred, as well, but with all the other conditions met you really can't go wrong! Tip: Nitrogen from ammonial sources generates higher levels of alkaloid content, so use a variety of mushroom that can handle higher nitrogen levels... like cubensis from cow pies...

By plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420) on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 03:21 am:

if it's got dmt in it, then that is probably the one i'm thinking of.. read about it a long time ago in a book called psychedelic shamanism.. thanks for the info

By ion ewe (Ion) on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 07:01 am:

Good book. A few technical errors, but still worth it. And, yes, it does...
I would suggest the Pharmacotheon, tIhkal, and a few of the exerpts and article copies available from Rosetta. Plants of the Gods is good for reference. Psilocybin Mushrooms of the World is an excellent book for the hunter. Check out Mind Books. (web addy is just a straight .com)


By plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420) on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 02:02 pm:

thanks ion....... you really are full of useful information aren't you?

By ion ewe (Ion) on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 06:28 am:

Old people can be that way...
...or they can be stuffed to the brim with dogma and lies...